Curse

majoho · May 16, 2010, 04:44 PM // 16:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by snaek

it doesn't matter whether or not this was intentional but gw1 is abandoned and left to die.

It's pretty much the norm that older games don't get frequent updates, the ONLY slight problem is that Anet promised something - but really people are taking things out of proportion.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Primary Assassin

Seriously? Fixing TPPK after 6 years? You're a retard, get the HELL out of my thread.

I hope there is a gutsy mod here that will deal with you as deserved - a ban would be well deserved for calling me a retard.

fireflyry · May 16, 2010, 05:17 PM // 17:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ninja Ninja

I stand by it. You live in hope/faith that the gw1 players will buy gw2, you do know that gw2 is not the only game coming out?

No wai?

lol

You really need to stop making assumptions and stating them as rebuttal.I couldn't care less what other players do.

I'm just more of a realist and fail to see GW2 facepalming based on the opinion of a handful of Guru posters.

I trust sales figures and market trends, especially concerning the non-subscription model, over your opinion.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ninja Ninja

Your version of play for fun is more like 5 years of inactivity.

Ummmm......re-rolling, helping out guild members, repeating content for challenge and enjoyment regardless of titles, farming, recruiting for my alliance, organising guild events, build testing and experimentation, helping new players and playing missions I haven't touched in years, trading, etc, etc, etc.

Your version of play for fun is maxing your mains titles in 2 months.That's not an error in the game, it's an error in your expectations, play style and attention span.

Enjoyment and game life span is subjective.If you can't get your head around that fine, but don't blame the game mechanics.

Quote:

Originally Posted by snaek

yes they will because anet can do something like that and get away with it--but it doesn't necessarily mean that its good or right.

Agreed, I don't think it's good behaviour either, especially in terms of Anets lack of response.

I personally wish they would just come out and say they can't/won't fix it so everyone could either move on or leave like they keep saying they will.Some honesty to the vets and player base here is highly deserved.I support that 110%.

In saying these types of complaints are rife on every MMO forum.

MMO's always have issues, and a passionate minority that will debate them.

Ninja Ninja · May 16, 2010, 05:20 PM // 17:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Primary Assassin

Seriously? Fixing TPPK after 6 years? You're a retard, get the HELL out of my thread.

Yeah keep the insults out of the thread, people can't take this seriously if you go down that path.
I know this a heated discussion about a tense topic but banter only takes away from the goal of the thread.

snaek · May 16, 2010, 05:36 PM // 17:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by majoho

It's pretty much the norm that older games don't get frequent updates, the ONLY slight problem is that Anet promised something - but really people are taking things out of proportion.

slight problem? i think anet has twisted priorities. they keep pushing out more and more broken content instead of fixing past/current problems. content updates are in a sense temporary fixes in terms of keeping players happy. like you said, they cannot afford to push out updates as often as they used to, so why are they continuing to rely on such temporary solutions? they should focus on more permanent fixes that have long-term benefits.

instead of trying to keep gw1 players happy until gw2 arrives, they should be keeping gw1 players happy. period. full stop. gw2 should not be in the equation. again, it just makes me think more and more that they truly do want to abandon gw1 and everyone to do the same, buying gw2 when it releases.

Ninja Ninja · May 16, 2010, 05:45 PM // 17:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by fireflyry

No wai?

lol

You really need to stop making assumptions and stating them as rebuttal.I couldn't care less what other players do.

I'm just more of a realist and fail to see GW2 facepalming based on the opinion of a handful of Guru posters.

I trust sales figures and market trends, especially concerning the non-subscription model, over your opinion.

Yeah and I trust that unless some bot prevention measures are taken before gw2 then any review site which examines the game a month or so after the release when all the omg hype has died down will see that its a game where bots rule and are completely unpunished by anet because they have NO WAY to tell who's a bot and who's not. If you cant see that's a problem in desperate need of attention I'm not sure what kind of competitive game your looking for. The reason why I originally bought gw1 was because of the graphics and the reason I'm here now is because I've been here for so long, if anet wants to throw away there player base I will have no problem finding another game coming out that has the same if not better graphics than gw and doesn't use the overused medieval magic genre of mmorpg.

Quote:

Originally Posted by fireflyry

Ummmm......re-rolling, helping out guild members, repeating content for challenge and enjoyment regardless of titles, farming, recruiting for my alliance, organising guild events, build testing and experimentation, helping new players and playing missions I haven't touched in years, trading, etc, etc, etc.

Your version of play for fun is maxing your mains titles in 2 months.That's not an error in the game, it's an error in your expectations, play style and attention span.

First off the 2 months was done on my main character, I was able to get a full set of characters through the game which I took my time with but still got done in less than a couple years.
You just listed all the top waste of time and money in the game, this is a competitive game that gives achievements and rewards them, its an error in your expectations, play style and attention span to expect the game to be anything different than what it is.

fireflyry · May 16, 2010, 06:15 PM // 18:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ninja Ninja

It took me 2 months to get all the pve titles for my main so how exactly are there people doing pve for 5 years?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ninja Ninja

First off the 2 months was done on my main character, I was able to get a full set of characters through the game which I took my time with but still got done in less than a couple years.

Contradict much?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ninja Ninja

You just listed all the top waste of time and money in the game, this is a competitive game that gives achievements and rewards them, its an error in your expectations, play style and attention span to expect the game to be anything different than what it is.

No it's not, because it is a different game for me, you, and anyone else that plays it, that's the whole point.

It's optional to be competitive, not a requirement.

What you consider a "waste"of time is hugely enjoyable for many players who have easily spent 5 years doing it and loving every moment.

You seem unable to grasp the simple concept of subjective enjoyment.

Anyway it's all bit cyclic now and I'd rather not clutter the thread.

Take it easy.

Ninja Ninja · May 16, 2010, 06:36 PM // 18:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by fireflyry

Contradict much?

In the post it says it took me 2 months to get all the pve titles on my main, the second post says it took 2 months to get all the pve titles on my main character. Where's the contradiction?

Quote:

Originally Posted by fireflyry

No it's not, because it is a different game for me, you, and anyone else that plays it, that's the whole point.

The only thing that makes this game different is a z-axis, the rest is the same anet trying to get the same population and more to buy and play there game.

Quote:

Originally Posted by fireflyry

It's optional to be competitive, not a requirement.

What you consider a "waste"of time is hugely enjoyable for many players who have easily spent 5 years doing it and loving every moment.

You seem unable to grasp the simple concept of subjective enjoyment.
Speaking as a person who has done many of those things I can say that wasting time and money helping other guildies you barely know is a waste, the best way to go is the pursuit of a common goal where you both do the same thing and are no way wasting time or indebted to the other.

Its not an option its the way its supposed to be played, you can pick up any online game and talk and interact with other people but that isn't doing what the game is designed to do, playing for fun is great and the titles were designed to reward you for that as long as your not doing the same thing for too long. I enjoy helping out new players in my spare time with faction missions but in no way do I consider myself more experienced by doing the same thing over again. Your form is picking up any online game and talking in the chat room and you feel like you actually playing the game? lol guess you must think being on guru is playing right now.

Quote:

Originally Posted by fireflyry

Anyway it's all bit cyclic now and I'd rather not clutter the thread.

Take it easy.

If you can't bring any factual ideas to the main topic of this thread instead of clinging to false hope then a break sounds good for you.

fireflyry · May 16, 2010, 06:58 PM // 18:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by snaek

again, it just makes me think more and more that they truly do want to abandon gw1 and everyone to do the same, buying gw2 when it releases.

Wouldn't that make perfect fiscal sense in a non-subscription model?

Ariovist Lynxkind · May 16, 2010, 07:37 PM // 19:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ninja Ninja

The truth is they haven't learned anything if they already had a fix for botting in gw2 they could easily go back and apply it but the truth is they don't, so history is just going to repeat itself.
Botting is a concern for GW2 and its something the OP cares about, the only way anets going to listen is if the news is spread out.

Different engine, different code. Who is to say that a fix for GW will be able to be applied to GW2? Who is to say those loopholes will be there in GW2. The current situation is that those creating the bots have found weaknesses and have taken advantage of their being little to no support from Anet's side to take care of it. GW2 will have a lot more support behind it, and they will have no doubt noticed the botting problem in GW1, even if they seemingly arent doing anything about it, and will fix things as far as the GW2 code goes

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ninja Ninja

Your trying to say that disgruntled gw1 buyers are gong to buy gw2 at some point and then with gw buying system they'll be stuck with it but the whole purpose of a trial is to sample the game and it wouldn't take me long to walk into pvp and see the same problems as gw1.

On the other hand, being such a new game, those problems might not have suck in yet. Unless of course you are planing on getting like a dozen 14 day/10 hour trials. You would be surprised at what gets missed in such a short time.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ninja Ninja

I really couldn't care less about the full force of anet, the only thing they will be able to do is make random bans on people suspected to be bots or taking an abuse way by taking players words. They have no system in place to detect botters.

Tried using the /report function? Not to mention having the full force of Anet behind it means more people to weed out the bots. And how do you know GW2 wont have such a system?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ninja Ninja

What? if your point was to show botting is increasing at a large scale rate recently because nothing is being done about it, then success.

Actually, that is exactly what I was intending to do. That, and pointing out the fact, at least pre-EotN that Anet had more resources behind the game back then instead of focusing on something else.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ninja Ninja

They wouldn't have to pull resources for anything, like I've been trying to get through to you a step in botting prevention in gw1 can be reused for gw2 so its NOT a waste unless you see a gw2 run by bots as a great game to play.

Sorry, but this is just like saying fixes for UT2K4 will work for UT3. Different engines, different code. There is a reason why they went back to scratch. Given that there is 7- 10 months left till it comes out, I would rather they use those resources on closing the loopholes in their new code than fix the old one so we dont get a repeat.

snaek · May 16, 2010, 07:53 PM // 19:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by fireflyry

Wouldn't that make perfect fiscal sense in a non-subscription model?

yes, anet is a business of and course they are out to make money. my point being at what expense to the players. even with their current situation, i think they could've still handled it better without sacrificing $$$$. most won't care once gw2 comes out. but there are a (small) group of people who loved gw1 and wish they'll be able to say the same about it a few years from now.

Skyy High · May 16, 2010, 08:22 PM // 20:22

If you had fun playing your first couple hundred (or thousand) hours of GW1, when it was actually fully supported by ANet, you would be cutting off your nose to spite your face if you didn't get GW2 based on the period of time when they very openly said that they were moving the vast majority of their team away from support for GW1. I would hope anyone who had fun playing GW1 in its heyday would realize this.

Quote:

Originally Posted by snaek

slight problem? i think anet has twisted priorities. they keep pushing out more and more broken content instead of fixing past/current problems. content updates are in a sense temporary fixes in terms of keeping players happy. like you said, they cannot afford to push out updates as often as they used to, so why are they continuing to rely on such temporary solutions? they should focus on more permanent fixes that have long-term benefits.

Maybe because the permanent fixes would take far greater an investment of time than they're willing to devote? Hmm? Maybe because these kinds of content patches are more useful and fun for the vast majority of players than fixing botting would be? If ANet took 3 months and had their Live Team just work on fixing botting, they might be able to declare "no more botting!" at the end of that time...to a resounding "meh...", "what, no content?" or "what's botting?" from the majority of the community. The forums aren't their largest consumer base, and these "temporary fixes" are keeping more people interested than fixing botting would. Sorry, it's true. I know I personally have been absolutely unaffected by botting, at least in any visible fashion. I'd still consider it impossible if not for the posts on this forum, because those posts are literally the only evidence I've seen of botting having a negative impact on the game, and I consider myself way more hardcore than the average player. Imagine what Joe Casual, who never visits a forum, would think if ANet didn't do anything all through the summer except deal with botting, he'd think he was being completely ignored! There are far more Joe Casuals in the game than forumites.

Quote:

instead of trying to keep gw1 players happy until gw2 arrives, they should be keeping gw1 players happy. period. full stop. gw2 should not be in the equation. again, it just makes me think more and more that they truly do want to abandon gw1 and everyone to do the same, buying gw2 when it releases.

Um...why should they just be trying to keep us happy, for no reason at all? They're a business. Their intention is to make GW2 the game that GW could never be. You got 5 years of enjoyment (or 3, at least, if we're counting until GW:EN's release) out of the game. You got what you paid for, they don't owe it to you to continue keeping you happy indefinitely. The entire point of keeping customers happy in this kind of business model is solely so they'll keep buying your products. It doesn't benefit them in any way if you're content to run around GW1 forever, and it shouldn't be something you expect any company to ever do.

Quote:

my point being at what expense to the players.

None. Absolutely, positively none. You got your money's worth, you're literally not paying for anything that they're doing now, or not doing now.

ruk1a · May 16, 2010, 08:40 PM // 20:40

Sadly I wish GW was p2p, then we'd get some decent service.

15/mo doesn't hurt my wallet.

Ninja Ninja · May 16, 2010, 08:48 PM // 20:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ariovist Lynxkind

Different engine, different code. Who is to say that a fix for GW will be able to be applied to GW2? Who is to say those loopholes will be there in GW2. The current situation is that those creating the bots have found weaknesses and have taken advantage of their being little to no support from Anet's side to take care of it. GW2 will have a lot more support behind it, and they will have no doubt noticed the botting problem in GW1, even if they seemingly arent doing anything about it, and will fix things as far as the GW2 code goes

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skyy High

If you had fun playing your first couple hundred (or thousand) hours of GW1, when it was actually fully supported by ANet, you would be cutting off your nose to spite your face if you didn't get GW2 based on the period of time when they very openly said that they were moving the vast majority of their team away from support for GW1. I would hope anyone who had fun playing GW1 in its heyday would realize this.

Alright so let me get this straight. By your logic anet is going to fix gw2 botting and there's going to allow botting now and forever in gw1 because they hate having the gw1 player base, and anyone who is now not botting or later is an idiot and they made the HoM not to reward dedicated old active players but just a way for you to get something extra in gw2 so when you go to buy gw2 you can be botting gw1 at the same time to further reward gw2 players.

*lemming* · May 16, 2010, 08:59 PM // 20:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ariovist Lynxkind

I do understand the magnitude of the problem.

Really now?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ariovist Lynxkind

Aion is still going, isnt it? there are quite a few competitive F2P games out there which are rife with bots out there that are surprisingly still going. Would I like to see them address the problems with GW1? sure, but I know they have only limited resources working on this game and they are working heavily on GW2 and I accept that, but that is just me.

You don't know what competitive means, do you?

jazilla · May 16, 2010, 09:01 PM // 21:01

Bots are par for the MMO course. Same with gold sellers. GW2 will have the same issues. It's unavoidable. It isn't the fault of the ANET staff though. They have moved on to GW2 and there is only a skeleton crew still there. YOU(meaning anyone who has done this) are the problem if you have ever ripped someone off, used bot programs, scammed, duped etc. You are the reason that those industries thrive. Until the players start using the tools that the mods put in place to help halt these actions, ANET's hands remain tied up. I see the same people posting in here about this who refuse to report bots. You want your cake and to eat it too, and ultimately we are partially responsible as players to keep those things at bay, or at least do our best to help. If you exploit the player base, you are part of the problem and have no right to cast first stones at other transgressors. Unless you like being hypocrites of course.

*lemming* · May 16, 2010, 09:04 PM // 21:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by jazilla

Bots are par for the MMO course. Same with gold sellers. GW2 will have the same issues. It's unavoidable. It isn't the fault of the ANET staff though. They have moved on to GW2 and there is only a skeleton crew still there. YOU(meaning anyone who has done this) are the problem if you have ever ripped someone off, used bot programs, scammed, duped etc. You are the reason that those industries thrive. Until the players start using the tools that the mods put in place to help halt these actions, ANET's hands remain tied up. I see the same people posting in here about this who refuse to report bots. You want your cake and to eat it too, and ultimately we are partially responsible as players to keep those things at bay, or at least do our best to help. If you exploit the player base, you are part of the problem and have no right to cast first stones at other transgressors. Unless you like being hypocrites of course.

If only this weren't the response to every single bot report:

Ninja Ninja · May 16, 2010, 09:07 PM // 21:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by jazilla

Bots are par for the MMO course. Same with gold sellers. GW2 will have the same issues. It's unavoidable. It isn't the fault of the ANET staff though. They have moved on to GW2 and there is only a skeleton crew still there. YOU(meaning anyone who has done this) are the problem if you have ever ripped someone off, used bot programs, scammed, duped etc. You are the reason that those industries thrive. Until the players start using the tools that the mods put in place to help halt these actions, ANET's hands remain tied up. I see the same people posting in here about this who refuse to report bots. You want your cake and to eat it too, and ultimately we are partially responsible as players to keep those things at bay, or at least do our best to help. If you exploit the player base, you are part of the problem and have no right to cast first stones at other transgressors. Unless you like being hypocrites of course.

There problem is lack of taking an effective stance against the bots in terms of banning to give them a reason not too.
I've never scammed anyone, I've never used a bot, anet ignores bot reports, I am perfect, what do I do?

snaek · May 16, 2010, 09:32 PM // 21:32

@skyhigh: you contradict yourself numerous times in your post. aside from that, you are misunderstanding what i mean by "keep players happy". gw was a great game, and i spent $200++ on a great game. all that was required was to maintain the game, but alas anet could not do this. instead they have constantly introduced new things which broke the game. i'd happily go back to the gw of yesteryear, but unfortunately i cannot, because i did not pay $200 for a game program, rather i paid $200 for an account to access an online game of which the devs can do to it as they wish. whether the pay model is monthly or a one-time fee, i'm still paying for the account, not the game.

whether or not you want to justify that $200 for a "couple hundred hours" of gameplay is a good deal or not is up to you. but i did not pay $200 for a "couple hundred hours", i paid $200 for a game that i can enjoy indefinitely, otherwise i would have just paid $15 a month and cancelled my subscription when i got bored of it.

also fyi, problems started creeping up long before the introduction of the live team. it was only when anet had a branded "live team" that people could identify something to voice complaint to. the closest thing before the "live team" would probably be "izzy" bashing.

Ninja Ninja · May 16, 2010, 09:39 PM // 21:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by snaek

also fyi, problems started creeping up long before the introduction of the live team. it was only when anet had a branded "live team" that people could identify something to voice complaint to. the closest thing before the "live team" would probably be "izzy" bashing.

Izzy was actually pretty good, gaile always had herself on DnD in international districts with fans and talking to people like there kids with "the frog" but I've actually messaged izzy and got a response(funny because his job wasn't community relations).

snaek · May 16, 2010, 09:44 PM // 21:44

^he received a ton of critique, but yea he was definitely more competent than the live team...just goes to show you the current state of gw.